Ahead of their new album, Written & Directed, we sat down with Black Honey vocalist Izzy Baxter Phillips, to discuss lockdown productivity and the issues faced by women in the music industry.
So how has your 2020 been? Have you managed to stay productive throughout all this time off?
“So, honestly, I feel like I’ve been the least productive I’ve ever been and probably my entire life. This whole year feels really slow. At the same time, I think has been good to reflect on everything. Once you tour for five years solid, you never really have a break. Like you have breaks, but you don’t really have real time to reflect. And I feel like I’ve had that, I’ve done a lot of healing and self-care. It’s something I’ve probably needed to do my whole life.”
How have you found going from that fast-paced nature of touring, to just stopping completely?
“I think in a sort of way, I think I’m kind of addicted to that speed and pace of things. I find it easy to do ten shows, and then go to the studio, and then write a song, and then go out on a night out, and wake up hungover and do it all over again. To me, that’s easier than stopping. Stopping means that you have to think and live with yourself and your thoughts and the past. You are without all of the chaos around you. And so I’ve definitely found that really hard. Being a musician is such a performative experience, and once you’ve got nobody around you to be performative for, you kinda lose your purpose a bit.”
I’ve seen other writers refer to Black Honey as falling into the genre of ‘female-fronted.’ What do you think of fact that people are more concerned with the gender of the band, rather than actual music?
“I don’t actually care about the female-fronted thing, I just think it’s kinda funny. I feel like now it has gone on for so long that I make it a joke, as an eye-roll. For ages I felt like it was still rare to be a woman, so guess that’s why people did it. I think it’s not going to age well. I don’t think in ten years time, people will still be referring to bands as being ‘female fronted’ or ‘girl bands.’ People aren’t going to be defined as a ‘trans artist,’ they’re just going to be an artist for what they are. I think it’s headed towards that world.”
So a while back, the band posted their hypothetical Dream Fest lineup, featuring artists that identified as female or non-binary. Why did you guys decide to do that?
“There are some very famous festivals which we are very keenly associated with announced a pretty shitty lineup, no shade or anything. This isn’t about cancelled culture or trying to call anyone out. I want to be able to have an open healthy conversation without being hateful but I really enjoyed it as a process.
I thought ‘I wonder what I would do, and how do I see things?’ I’m one person who can actually comment, because I’m a woman in a band. I know what it’s like to do these festivals and to have these experiences. I’ve been to a lot of them, so I just thought ‘fuck it, let’s make something that feels reflective of culture.’ It was so fun, the most fun part about it was the small artists, and finding the up and coming people and showing this amazing work. There are so many good bands out there, and I think it’s overwhelming how good everyone is at the moment.
It was hard to fit everyone on, it was hard to decide who the headliners were going to be. The whole thing was more difficult than I expected it to be, but it’s so enjoyable to do the research and actively sought out different genres. I learned a lot about my own internalised misogyny through doing that too.”
Do you think that people just don’t know that all of these bands are out there, or do you think that bookers just choose not to pick women and non-binary people for their lineups?
“I’m really scared that there are some stats out there that say that they sell more event tickets if they put white man bands on. I’m kind of convinced of that, I have no evidence of it though. There’s got to be a fucking season why the Gallaghers get booked every year. Other than the reason that they’re good, which they are, there’s got to be something else.”
In my role as a live photographer, I’ve slowly learned that there’s a very small amount of women, particularly behind the scenes. It just seems like touring is so heavily male dominated?
“It’s even harder if you’re in the crew because people are so hierarchical in the live touring world. It’s so old fashioned like that, and it’s literally all men. In our crew, we have to actively make a point of hiring 50% male and female crew. We have a female tour manager, and you know what? Everyone liked it better. We did a headline tour in 2018, and there were more women than men on the road with us, including the TMs and support bands. That was great, the boys loved it, everyone loved it. It was wicked, and one of my favourite tours.”
It’s nice to know that bands are actively looking to hire more women. I think that the group perception these days is that there is a lack of women behind the scenes in music, as though that is just ‘how it is.’
“We actively sought out female tour managers. We have a female lighting designer and a female sound engineer. You guys have it way harder than us as artists. When you’re on stage singing and you command that space, people give me respect. I’ve seen tour managers be talked to like shit by other road crew, I wouldn’t see my worst enemies be spoken to like that, it’s disgusting.”
It’s that weird perception that women working at live shows are ‘just groupies,’ and that the staff should be male to avoid that sort of thing. I’ve been told before by artists that they would prefer male photographers on their tour, to avoid those sorts of rumours.
“Yeah, what the fuck? Like you’re carrying cameras around? It just pisses me off. People have kicked me out of shows before because they thought I was a groupie. I would be the most unsubtle, eccentrically dressed, extreme groupie ever. It’s funny, isn’t it?”
It’s crazy to hear all these different stories, because when it’s just you dealing with them, it’s hard to know whether you’re the only one in that sort of situation. I think sometimes you can feel like this treatment is something to be expected?
“Yeah, you don’t even know! You don’t even know enough women to ask, that’s why I really value the women in the industry that I feel connected with. People like Ellie from Wolf Alice, and Laura-Mary from Blood Red Shoes. Speaking to other women who tour regularly, you relate t them on a level that is deeper. I fucking get what they go through, and there are only a handful of people who know that intimately. Touring in this specific climate, under these conditions. You’re such a minority, that you feel so deeply connected to anyone who has a relatable story. That’s what needs changing. How much easier would it be to manage if the industry was more open? If these things were spoken about?”
Totally! In terms of your musical releases throughout the pandemic, how has it been putting stuff out there, without a tour to coincide?
“It’s been really good to have stuff to release? I think I’d be going absolutely insane if I didn’t have that. So I feel like I’m making a really good illusion of looking busy whilst actually just sitting at home and chilling out, not really doing anything.
It feels good to have music out, and it’s been really well received. It has been streaming really, really well, and we are selling loads of records. Loads by our expectations anyway! I just feel really proud of everything, we have worked really fucking hard, and I absolutely love what we’ve made. I love my band, and it’s everything I want it to be.
The tracks have been pretty well received and it’s like streaming really, really well. And we are selling loads of records, or loads by our expectations! It just feels really good to be proud of that. So we are proud of everything we’ve done. I feel like we work fucking hard and I absolutely love what we’ve made. I love my band and it’s everything that I’d want it to be.”
